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Casual Adventurer
msa0412
Posts: 12
Registered: ‎04-06-2012

Skype account suspended right after payment !!!

I am shocked and surprised at the bad support service that I have got from skype.

 

I purchased ( subscribed ) for a skype service. Right after I subscribed for it, my account got blocked.

 

Right away, I contacted the LIVE SUPPORT and they said they cannot do anything because I am on a network that is flagged by the SKYPE system as fraud.

 

Okay, I am on a ISP network used by more than 800 users in my office and the whole building uses this network, building has 2600 employees

 

so the question is:

If I was on a fraudulent network -- Why did Skype charge my credit card and take my money and then right away suspend my account ?

Skype should have informed me before charging my credit card, that you are on a fraudulent network and cannot charge your credit card.

RATHER

SKYPE first charged my credit card and then right away blocked and suspended my account there by skype benefiting the money for no services provided.


This is the real fraud done by SKYPE and note that no such thing is mentioned in fair usage policy or anywhere on the skype website that if you are on a fraudulent network, skype will charge your credit card and take it as free money and right away block your account

 

here are the details of customer support chat

 

System says,

Thank you for contacting Skype Customer Support!
12:03:29 PM System says,
Pedrito R. has joined this session!
12:03:29 PM System says,
Connected with Pedrito R.
12:03:29 PM System says,
Thank you for contacting Skype Customer Support!
12:03:34 PM System says,
Please hold for the next available Live Support Agent.
12:03:35 PM msa0412 says,
hello
12:03:39 PM Pedrito R. says,
Hello! Welcome to Skype Live Support! My name is Pedrito. How may I help you?
12:03:54 PM msa0412 says,
I just subcribed to SKYPE
12:03:59 PM msa0412 says,
and my account got blocked ?
12:04:00 PM msa0412 says,
why ?
12:05:04 PM Pedrito R. says,
I understand that you wish to know the reason why your account was restricted. I will check on it for you.
12:05:17 PM Pedrito R. says,
For verification, can you confirm to me that your Skype name is msa0412?
12:05:24 PM msa0412 says,
i subscribed just few minutes ago
12:05:28 PM msa0412 says,
it is a brand new account
12:05:32 PM msa0412 says,
YES
12:05:50 PM Pedrito R. says,
May I have your name so I can address you properly?
12:06:18 PM msa0412 says,
***********
12:06:22 PM msa0412 says,
and address
12:06:27 PM msa0412 says,
as on the Credit caRD
12:06:32 PM msa0412 says,
***************
12:06:35 PM msa0412 says,
*****************
12:06:39 PM Pedrito R. says,
Thank you ********. Please give me a few minutes to check on your account.
12:07:35 PM msa0412 says,
ok
12:10:14 PM Pedrito R. says,
Please give me a couple of minutes more to review your account.
12:10:24 PM msa0412 says,
ok
12:10:48 PM msa0412 says,
not even 10 minutes past since buying credit in this account
12:11:05 PM msa0412 says,
and previously I spoke with another customer service agent called HANAN F.
12:15:57 PM msa0412 says,
are you there
12:16:25 PM Pedrito R. says,
Thank you for patiently waiting *******.
12:17:10 PM Pedrito R. says,
Upon review, I can see that your account was restricted since our filters indicates that you are using a computer network that has been fraudulently used.
12:17:35 PM msa0412 says,
computer network
12:17:45 PM msa0412 says,
we have a broadband in our office
12:17:53 PM msa0412 says,
our office has 800 employees
12:18:45 PM Pedrito R. says,
In that case, one of the accounts who may have used your network used their account fraudulently.
12:19:15 PM msa0412 says,
what is the solution ?
12:20:00 PM Pedrito R. says,
As much as we wanted to help, we can no longer reinstate your account. The only option you have is to create a new account using another network.
12:20:14 PM msa0412 says,
what about the money ?
12:20:29 PM msa0412 says,
It makes no sense ? why was my card charged if it was fraudulent network
12:20:34 PM msa0412 says,
skype should have notified me this
12:20:41 PM msa0412 says,
this looks like fraud from SKYPE side
12:20:56 PM msa0412 says,
first you charge my credit card then you block it right away !
12:21:32 PM Pedrito R. says,
I am sorry but our system may have just detected the network you used for your activity.
12:21:48 PM msa0412 says,
so, what is the fault of the customer if your system has a problem or issue
12:21:59 PM msa0412 says,
it makes no sense if your system is defective
12:22:04 PM msa0412 says,
I NEED FULL REFUND
12:23:10 PM Pedrito R. says,
Please understand that our system flags network that has been fraudulently used and prevent other accounts from using it to avoid anymore fraud.
12:23:44 PM msa0412 says,
1) I don't care, where does it say that in the fair usage policy -- that my account will be blocked if on fraudalent network
12:24:20 PM Pedrito R. says,
What you can do to get your money back is to dispute the purchase you made with your bank for them to issue a chargeback. Once chargeback has been issued, your payment will be returned to your account.
12:24:26 PM msa0412 says,
2) Why did SKYPE charge my credit card from the FRAUDULENT NETWORK if they were going to block the account ? Does it make any sense ? you charge and take my money from the same fraudulent network just to block it ?
12:24:42 PM msa0412 says,
Why i have to dispute to the bank ?
12:24:52 PM msa0412 says,
Is my bank the one who charged ?
12:25:00 PM msa0412 says,
or SKYPE is the one who charged ?
12:25:30 PM Pedrito R. says,
We will not be able to issue a refund since your account is currently restricted. In this regard, your bank will have to issue a chargeback for you.
12:26:04 PM msa0412 says,
I need to speak with your supervisor or manager
12:26:14 PM msa0412 says,
why was my card charged from a fraudulent network ?
12:26:27 PM msa0412 says,
does it make sense ? you charge then block the account ?
12:26:44 PM msa0412 says,
It clearly appears that Skype is involved in FRAUD
12:27:35 PM msa0412 says,
and also trying to contact SKYPE: Releasing your account

If your account has been suspended, you can submit a request to release it by contacting us and providing us with some information. Please note that any request to get an account back after a suspension will prompt a number of checks which might lead to further investigation and legal actions.
12:27:45 PM msa0412 says,
Why cannot you release the account ?
12:28:20 PM Pedrito R. says,
That is because your account is already been flagged to be using a network that has been fraudulently used.
12:28:48 PM msa0412 says,
Release the account now, and I will check the account from home
12:29:20 PM Pedrito R. says,
I am sorry but we can no longer reinstate it.
12:29:34 PM msa0412 says,
who can reinstate it ?
12:30:51 PM msa0412 says,
i like to speak with your manager/supervisor
12:32:47 PM msa0412 says,
?
12:35:15 PM Pedrito R. says,
I understand that you wish to speak to a supervisor but please note that your account will no longer be reinstated.
12:36:49 PM msa0412 says,
I would like to know the reason why SKYPE charged my credit card from a fraudulent network --- this itself is a fraud
12:36:57 PM Pedrito R. says,
The only option you have is to create a new account and dispute the purchase you made for your msa0412 account with your bank in order to get your money back.
12:37:12 PM msa0412 says,
and I thinking of putting a lawsuit !
12:37:25 PM msa0412 says,
I like to speak with your manager/supervisor
12:37:29 PM Pedrito R. says,
It may be possible that our system has not been detected the network you used until you made a payment.
12:37:36 PM msa0412 says,
may be possible ?
12:37:42 PM msa0412 says,
it is a guess work or what ?
12:37:51 PM msa0412 says,
does your system do guess work ?


 

 

 

Please use plain text.
Casual Adventurer
msa0412
Posts: 12
Registered: ‎04-06-2012

Re: Skype account suspended right after payment !!!

I am still on the live support and waiting for a resolution...

Very pathetic service by skype... unbelievable ...
Please use plain text.
Casual Adventurer
msa0412
Posts: 12
Registered: ‎04-06-2012

Re: Skype account suspended right after payment !!!

The continuation of SKYPE SUPPORT

 

Pedrito R. says,

It may be possible that our system has not been detected the network you used until you made a payment.
12:37:36 PM msa0412 says,
may be possible ?
12:37:42 PM msa0412 says,
it is a guess work or what ?
12:37:51 PM msa0412 says,
does your system do guess work ?
12:38:45 PM Pedrito R. says,
Moreover please note that Skype reserves the right to terminate or suspend accounts immediately if our policies have been breached or to avoid any fraudulent activities.
12:39:26 PM msa0412 says,
where does it say in your policy
12:39:29 PM msa0412 says,
SHOW ME THAT.
12:39:36 PM msa0412 says,
it is clear cut FRAUD by skype
12:39:42 PM msa0412 says,
I have read the policy
12:40:13 PM msa0412 says,
it says no where, that your credit card will be charged and then right away skype will suspend and block the account and take the free money !!!
12:42:07 PM msa0412 says,
show me where does it say in your policy
12:42:14 PM msa0412 says,
I have read it 2 times so far
12:44:09 PM msa0412 says,
I have posted this message [invalid URL]
12:44:28 PM msa0412 says,
and will post every where and waiting for you to show me where does it say in the policy
12:44:46 PM Pedrito R. says,
We do not intend to charge your card before we restrict it. It only happens that your purchase when through first before the restriction was made.
12:45:44 PM msa0412 says,
how can that be possible ?
12:46:14 PM msa0412 says,
please explain, your system seems to only do the guess work when suspending the account ?! but not when I am charged ?
12:46:39 PM msa0412 says,
first of all, you didn't answer my question: Where does it say in your policy about what you claim ?
12:46:52 PM msa0412 says,
Can you show me that first about your policy !
12:47:01 PM Pedrito R. says,
Our system may have detected your network you are using right after the purchase has been made.
12:49:06 PM msa0412 says,
Like I told you, I made the purchase from the same system and then your system right away blocked/suspended me after the purchase...SKYPE can track all the IP addresses and so what you claim is not true.. I am an IT Professional
12:49:56 PM msa0412 says,
1) I need you to show me where does it say in the POLICY as you made the claim
12:50:11 PM msa0412 says,
2) I need email contact of your manager or senior management in skype
12:51:19 PM msa0412 says,
This post will soon be posted all over --- the internet to show to the world that SKYPE is real fraud here... charge my credit card from the same network and then within 1 minute block/suspend my account ? that is take free money and provide no services against it, which is the clear cut fraud by all means.
12:57:59 PM msa0412 says,
i am still waiting
------------------------------
Dear Readers,
As you can clearly see, the customer support just gave a standard reply, as per our policy, and when asked to show where in the policy it says that SKYPE will charge my credit card from the fraudulent network only to block/suspend the account thereby skype taking free money from me -- there is still no reply
Please use plain text.
Casual Adventurer
msa0412
Posts: 12
Registered: ‎04-06-2012

Re: Skype account suspended right after payment !!!

The session ID for the above live chat skype support is : Session ID: 899351
and Skype support Pedrito R disappeared !!!
Please use plain text.
Casual Adventurer
msa0412
Posts: 12
Registered: ‎04-06-2012

Re: Skype account suspended right after payment !!!

Pedrito R did return back after making me wait for a long period 

albeit Pedrito was hoping that I would disappear or quit, but I did not.


The interesting part is that Pedrito returned back only to answer that he made a mistake in giving me the wrong explanation. Here is the continuation of the CHAT:

 

1:14:02 PM Pedrito R. says,

I am sorry for the long wait. I am trying to find a supervisor for you.

1:14:19 PM msa0412 says,

yes, also try to find the policy where it says what you have said !

1:20:27 PM Pedrito R. says,

Thank you for patiently waiting *******

1:20:51 PM msa0412 says,

still waiting

1:21:27 PM Pedrito R. says,

I really apologize that I cannot provide you with a clear explanation and details as to why your account has been blocked. The extent of information our system provides with us is restricted. The account blocking process is usually an automated process and is initiated when it detects certain abnormalities in customer accounts. It is in place to protect our customers’ security, which we take very seriously. If you wish, I can pass your case on to our specialist group. They will respond directly to you by email.

1:22:13 PM msa0412 says,

okay, but why did you first give me explanations which were unreasonable and unrealistic and no where mentioned in the SKYPE POLICY ?

1:22:17 PM msa0412 says,

can you answer that ?

1:23:12 PM Pedrito R. says,

That is what we can see on our side. However, a more clear explanation will be given to you by the appropriate department.

1:23:29 PM Pedrito R. says,

May I have the email address where we can contact you?

1:23:37 PM msa0412 says,

We are on a live support for more than 1 hour

1:24:19 PM msa0412 says,

You gave so many explanations and said it is mentioned in the SKYPE policy --- but when you were asked to show -- then you changed your tune and now you say << I really apologize that I cannot provide you with a clear explanation and details >>

1:24:43 PM msa0412 says,

doesn't this prove that 1) Skype Support is very bad 2) Skype is engaged in Fraud

1:27:07 PM Pedrito R. says,

I did not claim that my explanation is our Skype Policy. We are only explaining what possibly happened on your account.

1:27:17 PM Pedrito R. says,

*on'

1:27:54 PM msa0412 says,

scroll up and read where you have said << Pedrito R. says,
Moreover please note that Skype reserves the right to terminate or suspend accounts immediately if our policies have been breached or to avoid any fraudulent activities. >>

1:29:12 PM msa0412 says,

what policy has been breached and what fraud ?

1:29:42 PM Pedrito R. says,

That will be answered by the appropriate department who will be contacting you.

1:30:15 PM msa0412 says,

I will give you my business email ID

1:30:34 PM msa0412 says,

is that okay or it has to my same id on this skype account ?

1:30:52 PM Pedrito R. says,

Please do so and we will contact you through it. Yes, it is okay.

1:31:23 PM msa0412 says,

*************

1:32:27 PM Pedrito R. says,

Thank you for the information. Our specialized department will be contacting you through email.

1:32:42 PM Pedrito R. says,

Is there anything else I can help you with today?

1:33:39 PM msa0412 says,

when will someone from SKYPE contact me ?

1:34:27 PM Pedrito R. says,

Yes, you are correct. They will contact you.

1:34:47 PM msa0412 says,

when ? After 10 years ? after 5 years ? after 1 year ?

1:34:59 PM msa0412 says,

is there any time frame -- within next 24 hours or 72 hours ?

1:35:09 PM msa0412 says,

or should I wait for a reply in the next 10 years ?

1:35:52 PM Pedrito R. says,

You will be contacted as soon as possible. Rest assured that it will not take a few days.

1:36:44 PM msa0412 says,

okay.

1:37:12 PM Pedrito R. says,

It's been a pleasure speaking with you today. Thank you for contacting Skype Live Support, have a great day.

We value your feedback. Please be aware that we will ask you a few questions after closing the chat window about your experience with us today.

Once you are ready please click on the "Exit" button.

Session ID: 899351 

Please use plain text.
Casual Adventurer
msa0412
Posts: 12
Registered: ‎04-06-2012

Re: Skype account suspended right after payment !!!

still no answer from SKYPE FRAUDSTERS
Please use plain text.
Novel Adventurer
m786
Posts: 4
Registered: ‎05-06-2012

Re: Skype account suspended right after payment !!!

Hello,

 

I have been using my account for more than 1 year. I have paid almost $300+ since I joined Skype. I use Skype for Business and Personal Use.

 

Today, When I logged in, I found a message saying: My account has been suspended and I should contact Customer Support. I did as requested by Skype to find out why my account was blocked but no real reason was given. I have ***MONEY*** in my account and I am unable to use my skype account and don't know for how long it will be blocked. This is getting real worse and frustrating. 

 

This is what I got reply from SKYPE CUSTOMER SUPPORT

 

Session ID: 901064

 

11:44:06 System says,

Thank you for contacting Skype Customer Support!

11:44:10 System says,

Please hold for the next available Live Support Agent.

11:45:00 System says,

We appreciate your patience. Please continue to hold for the next available representative.

11:45:35 System says,

Debbie Lyn E. has joined this session!

11:45:35 System says,

Connected with Debbie Lyn E.

11:45:35 System says,

Thank you for contacting Skype Customer Support!

11:45:45 Debbie Lyn E. says,

Hello! Welcome to Skype Live Support! My name is Debbie Lyn E. How may I help you?

11:46:02 m786 says,

Hello Debbie

11:46:39 m786 says,

skype: m786

11:47:16 Debbie Lyn E. says,

I'm sorry to hear that your account has been suspended.

11:47:22 Debbie Lyn E. says,

I will look into this for you.

11:47:32 m786 says,

I don't know what's going on with SKYPE and suspending the accounts

11:48:06 Debbie Lyn E. says,

I'm sorry for the inconvenience.

11:48:16 Debbie Lyn E. says,

I will be checking this for you.

11:48:28 m786 says,

ok

11:49:01 Debbie Lyn E. says,

Please give me 2 minutes for this. I will be with you shortly.

11:49:27 m786 says,

ok

11:53:36 Debbie Lyn E. says,

Thanks for waiting.

11:53:46 Debbie Lyn E. says,

Please bear with me as I'm still reviewing your account.

11:54:04 m786 says,

ok

11:56:42 Debbie Lyn E. says,

Thank you for patiently waiting.

11:57:07 m786 says,

ok

11:57:17 Debbie Lyn E. says,

We are currently investigating your account.

11:57:22 Debbie Lyn E. says,

Unfortunately for the time being it must remain suspended until further notice while we continue to investigate whether the activity that has taken place within the account has violated our Terms of Use: www.skype.com/go/tou

11:57:31 m786 says,

ok

11:57:43 m786 says,

I will wait for the investigation to complete

11:57:45 m786 says,

thanks

11:58:02 Debbie Lyn E. says,

Yes, please.

11:58:05 Debbie Lyn E. says,

Thank you for your patience.

11:58:08 m786 says,

what terms has been violated by me ?

11:58:11 Debbie Lyn E. says,

Is there anything else I can help you with today?


Please use plain text.
Novel Adventurer
m786
Posts: 4
Registered: ‎05-06-2012

Re: Skype account suspended right after payment !!!

Another Skype Support Chat Session with no replies / gurantees

 

 

Session ID: 901085


System says,
Thank you for contacting Skype Customer Support!
12:05:26 System says,
Jason M. has joined this session!
12:05:26 System says,
Connected with Jason M.
12:05:26 System says,
Thank you for contacting Skype Customer Support!
12:05:34 m786 says,
Hello Jason
12:05:34 Jason M. says,
Hello! Welcome to Skype Live Support! My name is Jason. How may I help you?
12:05:44 m786 says,
Can you please check why my account has suddenly suspended
12:06:11 Jason M. says,
I'm sorry to hear that your account is restricted as of the moment.
12:06:16 Jason M. says,
Let me check your account first.
12:06:26 m786 says,
skype: m786
12:07:52 Jason M. says,
Thanks, let me check on that.
12:08:06 Jason M. says,
But before we proceed, may I have your first name please so that I can address you properly?
12:08:11 m786 says,
Fadi
12:08:46 Jason M. says,
Thanks Fadi.
12:12:11 Jason M. says,
We are still checking your account.
12:13:16 m786 says,
ok
12:16:16 Jason M. says,
Please us give us few more minutes.
12:16:51 m786 says,
ok
12:22:01 Jason M. says,
Thanks for waiting.
12:22:36 Jason M. says,
We understand your concern regarding your Skype account status. Unfortunately for the time being it must remain suspended until further notice while we continue to investigate whether the activity that has taken place within the account has violated our Terms of Use: www.skype.com/go/tou
12:23:44 m786 says,
so, will there be an answer from skype
12:24:00 m786 says,
like the reason it has been violated -- which term
12:24:06 m786 says,
or will I be kept in dark
12:24:14 m786 says,
and how many days I need to wait for it ?
12:25:56 Jason M. says,
I cannot give you a specific time frame.
12:26:36 Jason M. says,
I also cannot guarantee that the restriction will be unblocked. Though you can still log in to your account but you can only make free features and not the paid ones.
12:26:57 Jason M. says,
In the meantime, I highly suggest that you create a new account.
12:27:44 m786 says,
why should I create a new account and same problem could happen -- and that too I use paid services and again i will loose more money ??
12:28:21 m786 says,
What is the use of your advice ? to create new account
12:29:23 m786 says,
I don't understand ? is SKYPE making money this way ? I have money in my account and you blocked and you say no gurantee and you ask me to open a new account and what is the gurantee as soon as I open the account and make a payment you will NOT BLOCK or SUSPEND it ?
12:30:42 Jason M. says,
I suggest that you create a new account with a new email address in a different computer and make a purchase with a different card.
12:30:52 Jason M. says,
I apologize for the inconvenience this has caused.
12:31:07 m786 says,
and then do you gurantee that it will be not blocked/suspended ?
12:32:17 Jason M. says,
So long as you religiously follow our policies.
12:33:27 m786 says,
but you didn't mention which policy i violated - so how do I know even if I have violated or not -- it could be SKYPE SCAM ?
12:34:12 Jason M. says,
I can guarantee it is not. As of the moment, I apologize but we still need to investigate.
12:35:05 m786 says,
okay, I will create a new account with a new computer and new card payment and will see what happens....... If the same thing happens then SKYPE IS SCAM AND FRAUD.
12:35:08 m786 says,
let us see that.
12:35:09 m786 says,
thanks

Please use plain text.
Novel Adventurer
m786
Posts: 4
Registered: ‎05-06-2012

Re: Skype account suspended right after payment !!!

Still my account is suspended. No action has been taken by fraudsters @ SKYPE , the crooks stealing people's money in screwed ,  crooked , wicked methods.

Please use plain text.
Novel Adventurer
m786
Posts: 4
Registered: ‎05-06-2012

Re: Skype account suspended right after payment !!!

Skype customer support are fraudsters and scammers.

 

Avoid bying from Skype... Move to other service providers like GOOGLE or YAHOO or ACTIONVOIP.

 

See the last response by these fraudsters who stole my money.

 

Session ID: 907761

System says,
Thank you for contacting Skype Customer Support!
12:30:52 PM System says,
Cheryl Marie G. has joined this session!
12:30:52 PM System says,
Connected with Cheryl Marie G.
12:30:52 PM System says,
Thank you for contacting Skype Customer Support!
12:31:03 PM m******k786 says,
yes
12:31:10 PM Cheryl Marie G. says,
Hello! Welcome to Skype Live Support! My name is Cheryl. How may I help you?
12:31:39 PM m******k786 says,
Why my account is still blocked/suspended -- so many days passed and investigation has still not finished
12:31:43 PM m******k786 says,
what's going on ?
12:33:47 PM Cheryl Marie G. says,
I am sorry to hear that your account is still restricted.
12:34:02 PM Cheryl Marie G. says,
Let me check on this for you.
12:34:17 PM Cheryl Marie G. says,
May I have your name and your username please?
12:36:09 PM m******k says,
username
12:36:12 PM m******k7 says,
m******k786
12:36:15 PM m******k7 says,
name : ******
12:37:12 PM Cheryl Marie G. says,
Thank you ******. Please hold.
12:39:22 PM Cheryl Marie G. says,
Thank you so much for your patience.
12:39:27 PM Cheryl Marie G. says,
We are very sorry but we can't unblock your account.
12:39:42 PM Cheryl Marie G. says,
Our filters indicate that your Skype account is using a computer network that has been previously used fraudulently.
12:42:03 PM Cheryl Marie G. says,
May I know if we are still connected?
12:42:48 PM m******k786 says,
yes
12:43:13 PM m******k786 says,
It is ISP network
12:43:21 PM m******k786 says,
which has around 3000+ employees
12:43:25 PM m******k786 says,
who use the same network
12:43:47 PM m******k786 says,
so, is it the final answer, you cannot block or still under investigation
12:44:03 PM m******k786 says,
or you have the authority to make the decision to unblock or block ?
12:45:03 PM Cheryl Marie G. says,
I am sorry but the restriction on your account cannot be lifted.
12:46:56 PM m******k786 says,
says who
12:47:02 PM m******k786 says,
you or the investigation department ?
12:47:06 PM m******k786 says,
please make this clear for me
12:47:21 PM m******k786 says,
because i have already posted this everywhere on the internet
12:47:28 PM m******k786 says,
including skype community boards
12:47:58 PM m******k786 says,
i want to have a definite answer
12:48:06 PM m******k786 says,
so i can take the appropriate action
12:48:43 PM Cheryl Marie G. says,
I am really sorry. The account has been already reviewed and investigated by our fraud team and I am sorry that it cannot be reinstated anymore.
12:49:28 PM m******k786 says,
http://community.skype.com/t5/Payments-and-Billing/Skype-account-suspended-right-after-payment/td-p/...
12:49:53 PM m******k786 says,
so why did SKYPE lie to me when your customer support said: Someone from the investigation team will send me an email ?
12:50:06 PM m******k786 says,
why there was no email from your investigation team that it cannot be reinstated
12:50:15 PM m******k786 says,
Why do I always have to contact SKYPE
12:50:26 PM m******k786 says,
this is clear FRAUD AND SCAM by SKYPE
12:50:36 PM m******k786 says,
what is the reason given that I have violated the TOC ?

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